From the wacky world of battery power

[pirateprentice]

A cup of cold sick for New Jaguar's director of marketing.

ArsTechnica reports:

Jaguar I-Pace fire risk leads to recall, instructions to park outdoors

Jaguar issues a recall for some model-year 2019 I-Paces due to a fire risk, probably caused by badly folded battery anode tabs.
To date, three fires have been reported following software updates, which Jaguar's recall report says does not provide "an appropriate level of protection for the 2019MY vehicles in the US."
A software update will limit the maximum charge of the affected cars to 80 percent, to prevent the packs from charging to 100 percent. Jaguar also says that, similar to other OEMs who have conducted recalls for similar problems, the patched I-Paces should be parked away from structures for 30 days post-recall and should be charged outdoors where possible.

(my emphasis)

 

[scm]

That's about the fourth recall that's been issued for dodgy batteries. I follow the UK i-Pace forum to see what's happening and I'm rather surprised by how casually they seem to take the prospect of battery fires: "... more ICEVs catch fire than EVs and you get plenty of warning of an impending battery fire so you can get everyone out of the vehicle." I hope they're right, because when a lithium battery starts off-gassing it doesn't take long to go ballistic.

John Cadogan's Youtube channel found some New Zealand research that showed the majority of vehicles fires happened to those over 10 years old and were caused by arson. Next on the list of causes were electrical fires - now which vehicle has the most electricity?

 

[cj10jeeper]

Worth a read from Honest John if you want some real numbers behind EV fires and safety

https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/the-latest-car-fire-statistics/#:~:text=How%20Many%20Electric%20Cars%20Caught,1%20to%20March%2031%2C%202023.

Draw your own conclusions about ev fires from the raft of sources quoted, but my take is they are very rare compared to ICE’s by volume, percentage and miles, etc.

 

[pirateprentice]

Draw your own conclusions about ev fires from the raft of sources quoted, but my take is they are very rare compared to ICE’s by volume, percentage and miles, etc.

This is not about EVs in general.

Honest John says "A passenger EV battery has 0.0012% of catching fire." or roughly one in 100,000.
The ArsTechnica report says that of 2760 affected I-Pace in the US, 3 of them have caught fire so far - more like 1 in 1000, or 100 times worse than industry average.
It also says "To date, three fires have been reported following software updates", which means that those I-Pace buyers who rationally gauged the 1 in 100,000 risk of a fire suddenly had those chances increased by a factor of 100 without any physical change to the car. And then they had their range reduced by 20% by a further software update.

That's why it is a problem for New Jaguar's marketing department.

 

[cj10jeeper]

Totally agree re issues on the iPace and JLR have a poor record of addressing faults. One of the reasons I chose not to buy an iPace opting elsewhere for a EV. Certainly not good news for a brand about to go all in on EV’s.

 

[Kev]

This is an interesting presentation by Professor Paul Christensen regarding EV fires; simple, factual and easy to understand

 

[scm]

The real issue that EVangelists refuse to address is the massive lithium battery so full of energy. While at present the fire risk seems lower than ICEVs the resulting fire is so much worse than a simple gasoline blaze that can be easily extinguished by starving it of oxygen - low probability, very high consequence.

 

[WShudds]

The real issue that EVangelists refuse to address is the massive lithium battery so full of energy. While at present the fire risk seems lower than ICEVs the resulting fire is so much worse than a simple gasoline blaze that can be easily extinguished by starving it of oxygen - low probability, very high consequence.

I second that. The intensity of the "rapid disassembly" matters. Even though episodes like the Luton car park were not triggered by an EV, how much worse was it because high-powered EVs caught fire? If a house can go bust in less than 5 minutes with an electric bike battery that caught fire, imagine a busy car park where say 20% of the vehicles were EVs!

It's interesting how the authorities quickly disclosed how the fire started (electric fault on a diesel SUV) but didn't say how many EVs were among the 1,400 cars that perished. We can guess about 300. And I couldn't find anything on how public buildings should be adapted to deal with such risk either.

 

[scm]

Even though episodes like the Luton car park were not triggered by an EV ....

The picture I saw of the car in flames sure didn't look like an ICEV fire - bright white flames shooting out from the left side behind the front wheel. Is that where a hybrid battery is located? There was also a fire extinguisher laying nearby, which presumably could have extinguished a regular fire. So I remain skeptical.

 

[cj10jeeper]

Even though episodes like the Luton car park were not triggered by an EV ....

The picture I saw of the car in flames sure didn't look like an ICEV fire - bright white flames shooting out from the left side behind the front wheel. Is that where a hybrid battery is located? There was also a fire extinguisher laying nearby, which presumably could have extinguished a regular fire. So I remain skeptical.

Conspiracy theory?
It was a RR Sport,. Diesel, not hybrid, EV, etc.
Flames look like fuel to me and there’s, no gas cloud, explosion, fireworks, etc.. The real issue there was the way a car park built and opened in 2019 was itself the main cause of the spread.