Stop me .... new brakes

[msdmjb44]

Folks, my 58k mile 2013 V8S is still running the original discs which have been flagged as excessively corroded on the inner faces, also have quite a lip so the time for changing is nigh.
Jag main dealer is asking for £808 fitted for new OE front discs and pads but am aware of other brake manufacturer options. For example MTEC front and rears would come in considerably less and I could use a local garage to me to fit them.

Is it a DIY job? Anybody had any issues and would spare the torque settings for the various bolts, I have done motorcycle brakes before but would be my first time on a car.
The reason for looking into the change is most of my heavy braking is done enjoying mountainous roads in Europe and have already felt the dead pedal syndrome and the fear of what a 2ton 'sports' car would look like after failing to stop on a hairpin!

Thanks

 

[Lunar]

Eurocarparts should give disc and pad options such as Bosch, Pagid, etc. that will be fine - look for coated ones, so the unswept area is protected from rust.

It’s a fairly straight-forward process if you gather the correct tools and information first - e.g. putting the electronic handbrake into service mode.

If the existing discs are stuck in place look for a threaded hole in the disc you can screw a bolt into and slowly break the rusty seal.

Else put the wheel back on and give the outer edges a good kick with trainers or other shoes that aren’t going to mark your wheels.

Alternatively, as you’re binning the discs anyway just give them a good whack with a hammer, being careful not to hit other parts of the car.

If not done recently I’d take the opportunity to change the brake fluid too.

 

[RPSN]

Yes, it’s a DIY job if you fancy it.

I’ve recently fitted Brembo front pads and a Delphi pad wear sensor on mine which has the High Performance braking system with red calipers. I paid around £120 for the parts. I had to buy a 1/2"Drive, 9mm Hex Key bit for the caliper guide pins as shown here... https://www.lasertools.co.uk/Product/7707/Hex-Key-1-2-inch-drive-9mm-for-Brake-Calipers
The front caliper guide pins torque setting is 58 Nm.

There’s been no need for me to replace the discs but when the time comes I’ll be looking at discs such as Brembo or Delphi. If I were to purchase the Brembo 380mm front discs now I could get them for around £300 in total.

 

[JAGBOB]

Yes, it’s a DIY job if you fancy it.

I’ve recently fitted Brembo front pads and a Delphi pad wear sensor on mine which has the High Performance braking system with red calipers. I paid around £120 for the parts. I had to buy a 1/2"Drive, 9mm Hex Key bit for the caliper guide pins as shown here... https://www.lasertools.co.uk/Product/7707/Hex-Key-1-2-inch-drive-9mm-for-Brake-Calipers
The front caliper guide pins torque setting is 58 Nm.

There’s been no need for me to replace the discs but when the time comes I’ll be looking at discs such as Brembo or Delphi. If I were to purchase the Brembo 380mm front discs now I could get them for around £300 in total.

You can buy MTEC ones for £130 delivered a pair. I have fitted them on many cars and no issues.

 

[JAGBOB]

Folks, my 58k mile 2013 V8S is still running the original discs which have been flagged as excessively corroded on the inner faces, also have quite a lip so the time for changing is nigh.
Jag main dealer is asking for £808 fitted for new OE front discs and pads but am aware of other brake manufacturer options. For example MTEC front and rears would come in considerably less and I could use a local garage to me to fit them.

Is it a DIY job? Anybody had any issues and would spare the torque settings for the various bolts, I have done motorcycle brakes before but would be my first time on a car.
The reason for looking into the change is most of my heavy braking is done enjoying mountainous roads in Europe and have already felt the dead pedal syndrome and the fear of what a 2ton 'sports' car would look like after failing to stop on a hairpin!

Thanks

I fitted MTEC front and rears with Mintex pads for approx £340. Where are you located as I can fit them for you cheap at Penrith Cumbria.

 

[RPSN]

Yes, it’s a DIY job if you fancy it.

I’ve recently fitted Brembo front pads and a Delphi pad wear sensor on mine which has the High Performance braking system with red calipers. I paid around £120 for the parts. I had to buy a 1/2"Drive, 9mm Hex Key bit for the caliper guide pins as shown here... https://www.lasertools.co.uk/Product/7707/Hex-Key-1-2-inch-drive-9mm-for-Brake-Calipers
The front caliper guide pins torque setting is 58 Nm.

There’s been no need for me to replace the discs but when the time comes I’ll be looking at discs such as Brembo or Delphi. If I were to purchase the Brembo 380mm front discs now I could get them for around £300 in total.

You can buy MTEC ones for £130 delivered a pair. I have fitted them on many cars and no issues.

That maybe so but Brembo brake discs are superior to MTEC. Personally, on a car such as the F-Type I wouldn’t entertain the more budget-friendly option....

 

[msdmjb44]

Thanks for the input, am aware of the options and brands.
Another of my cars has front discs that cost well into 4 figures before fitting and are non-ceramics so price isn't the biggest factor however for a fun car lightly used in sunshine only I don't want to go over the top .... although nor do I want to go over the top of a mountain hairpin.
Looking at random car forums MTEC does seem to have a decent reputation when mated with yellowstuff pads.

Any suggestions on where to buy Brembos for me to look into (e.g. autodoc?), will be changing all four discs and have the super performance brakes or whatever they are called i.e. 380 upfront and 376 rears.
MTEC will deliver all the parts to Europe.

 

[RPSN]

The Jaguar Original Equipment (OE) part numbers for your car are here...

Front brakes: https://parts.jaguarlandroverclassic.com/parts/index/part/id/152.1065.2369.11110/brand/jaguar/

Rear brakes: https://parts.jaguarlandroverclassic.com/parts/index/part/id/152.1065.2369.11111/brand/jaguar/

The Brembo and OE part numbers are here...https://www.bremboparts.com/europe/en

These are the Autodoc links for the Brembo discs, pads and wear sensors for your car...

Front discs 380mm: https://www.autodoc.co.uk/brembo/15251224
Front pads: https://www.autodoc.co.uk/brembo/11804296
Front wear sensor: https://www.autodoc.co.uk/brembo/8217100

Rear discs 376mm: https://www.autodoc.co.uk/brembo/15251225
Rear pads: https://www.autodoc.co.uk/brembo/11804300
Rear wear sensor: https://www.autodoc.co.uk/brembo/10567414

 

[cj10jeeper]

Looking back at your post you seem to have concerns about brake fade during heavy braking in mountains.
Swapping the discs will help a little simply because the replacements will have more metal in them to absorb and dissipate heat, however I think you have to look further than just a generic swap of discs and pads.

You may wish to do some or all of the following:
Replace the pads with higher performance, more track focussed as they will operate at higher temperatures before they fade, but work less well when cold, so a trade off.
Replace the discs with those which have dimples or grooves as they assist cooling, but may make more noise. Drilling often results in cracking, so is less favourable. They also look great
Check and or replace the brake fluid with a higher spec. product that will not boil so easily and also the change will remove almost inevitable water in the fluid, which lowers the boiling point.
Replace all the flexible brake hoses as they won't have been done and are now 12 years old, so will themselves and to sponginess in the pedal. Mine were shot at and corroded at the same age
Not parts specific, but use your gears more to brake and less pedal as it's inevitable you'll overheat any road focussed system.

You should also change all discs and pads at the same time if you want to extract performance from the car so they all work with the same characteristics.

I've recently done all 4 corner with grooved and dimpled MTEC discs, Pagid pads, oem flexible hoses and wear sensors. I found as others have the results of MTEC to be excellent.

The job will also be a lot easier if you have a caliper wind back tool to press the pistons in to accommodate the new pads. You'll also need brake grease for back of the pads to stop them squeaking and brake fluid to top up.
Plenty of you tube videos on the job.

 

[Lunar]

Are these wind back callipers?

I seem to remember, with the calliper off and supported, just (watching the open lid brake fluid level first) gently pushing the pistons back with a length of wood or an extension bar between the old pads before you remove them, but maybe that’s a false memory?

For my daughter’s Mazda I just used a pair of long nosed pliers into the dimples and rotated the piston, having soaked it with penetrating oil first.

 

[cj10jeeper]

Are these wind back callipers?

I seem to remember, with the calliper off and supported, just (watching the open lid brake fluid level first) gently pushing the pistons back with a length of wood or an extension bar between the old pads before you remove them, but maybe that’s a false memory?

For my daughter’s Mazda I just used a pair of long nosed pliers into the dimples and rotated the piston, having soaked it with penetrating oil first.

No they are not wind back, but as you correctly recall, straight push back. Gone are days for me of trying to lever pistons in with pieces of wood when this tool is cheap as chips and moves them in smoothly with zero effort.
You can also be in full control of how much they move so know the amount the reservoir fluid rises each time.

This looks identical to what I use for just £10:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/395995516237?chn=ps&_ul=GB&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&amdata=enc%3A1INKcJRsASU-FrB4fQfh64w24&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-134428-41853-0&mkcid=2&mkscid=101&itemid=395995516237&targetid=2361267413036&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9046425&poi=&campaignid=21722849900&mkgroupid=168412456995&rlsatarget=pla-2361267413036&abcId=10033986&merchantid=6995734&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=21722849900&gbraid=0AAAAAD_Lr1dITc0i7vZcpGZ_fyMfwdree&gclid=Cj0KCQjwzt_FBhCEARIsAJGFWVlMRIHkJk1DZ_a3CPQrGimDW-aadSAILYgGf0HsgmZ3EEOiSFD5X60aAo__EALw_wcB

 

[RPSN]

@msdmjb44 If you’re going to DIY remember to use the ‘EPB Maintenance Mode Activation and Deactivation’ when removing and installing new rear brake pads or discs (see attached screenshot).

Before removing the caliper guide pins you can retract the caliper piston/s by inserting a large flat-blade screwdriver in through the recess at the top of the caliper then levering the caliper against the disc. Do it a bit at a time and check the brake fluid level whilst in the process to ensure it doesn’t overflow.

Use a thin smear of silicon brake grease on the rear of the new pads and caliper guide pins. Don’t use copper grease as it’s an anti-seize compound containing copper particles and a petroleum-based carrier that can melt, damage rubber, interfere with electronic sensors, and even cause brakes to squeal or glaze.

 

[cj10jeeper]

Correct re grease type and edited my post.
I actually use Ferodo brake grease.

 

[RPSN]

Correct re grease type and edited my post.
I actually use Ferodo brake grease.

 

[msdmjb44]

Really appreciate the input and help folks, lots of really relevant info.
Good to know of the expertise sitting in this forum.

Currently discussing with Goodridge why they don't already do an off the shelf kit for the lines.
Slightly embarrassing not thinking of replacing the lines, have replaced them on all my motorbikes!
Being from Northern Ireland I do have some bias so likely buying the MTEC dimpled and grooved running yellow stuff, will assign a day to get it all done and will work my way around.

 

[cj10jeeper]

I looked into the HEL braided option but decided not to go that route as I obtained SVR oem versions. If good enough for that model then I’m OK. I also didn’t want the wait, or potential issues of specification of all the connections and other brackets.

Rear hoses to brake pipe are a bit fiddly to access. You may also need to purge the ABS system, but can avoid it if you clamp the brake pedal a couple of inches down.
Happy to give more info when you have decided what your opting for.

If you do go for MTEC opt for the extra coating. Protects from corrosion and look great.

 

[RPSN]

Being from Northern Ireland I do have some bias so likely buying the MTEC dimpled and grooved running yellow stuff, will assign a day to get it all done and will work my way around.

If you decide on the MTEC brake discs hopefully they will live up to your expectations? However, after reading this...

The reason for looking into the change is most of my heavy braking is done enjoying mountainous roads in Europe and have already felt the dead pedal syndrome and the fear of what a 2ton 'sports' car would look like after failing to stop on a hairpin!

....the better option would be Brembo which are not that much more expensive. They are top quality high-carbon discs with a coated surface and offer reliability, stability, performance, heat resistance and long term value. The total price difference between them (both front and rear discs with coating) being around £70 inc delivery (Autodoc and MTEC prices).

As the saying goes...“You pays your money and you takes your choice.”

 

[msdmjb44]

Folks, once again thank you for your input and help on this .... part numbers, 9mm long hex key etc

I ordered up Brembo discs and pads online from Autodoc in France and I think for the first time ever the parts were cheaper than the UK, came in at just over £550 all in including a couple of new wear sensors. I spend probably 7hrs all in replacing all four corners, first wheel was 3hrs then got much quicker as I did more. The first wheel had a few corrosion issues requiring a persuader tool etc and tbh I was enjoying my time working through the process. Not complex, enjoyable and would encourage anybody to consider doing it themselves. Being more used to mbike discs the weight of the Brembo discs really surprised me.

After fitting the brakes are still being bedded in but after a fluid change I expect them to be better than the originals. Once bedded in I will try and get a trip to the Pyrenees before they turn white to give them a good workout.

Few final things ....
- when tightening up one of the wheel nuts to torque the Jaguar wheel nut broke! I have replaced literally hundreds of wheel nuts and this is the first ever, don't understand why but hey ho could have been a lot worse as I could still remove the broken bolt very easily.
- does anybody know the part numbers of the screws/clips that attach the front wheel arch liner to the car at the bottom of the front of the wheel well? It seems I am missing 3 which enables the front underbody plastics to move a bit too much .... just found them, they are C2P11837 but bladdy hell is it hard finding any to buy!
- most importantly, from the outside looking in the front discs actually looked fine, they are the original Jag discs after 58k miles. They were a little lipped but cleaned up nicely under use and in general worked fine. The inside disc on both sides was a different story (see pictures). The corrosion on the inner disc really surprised me and can't understand how that passed an MOT late last year.
- with the front wheels off it looks like the bottom of both springs are heavily corroded so will likely need replacing in the not too distant future.

 

[RPSN]

Good choice with the Brembo brake discs and pads.

Your JLR main dealer will be able to order the front wheel arch liner M6 x 16mm torx bolts that you require (part number C2P11837) but due to the current parts supply issues it may take a couple of weeks for them to come in?

In the meantime (unless you've found them elsewhere) I can tell you that these M6 x 16mm zinc plated steel roofing bolts (mushroom head) will do the job perfectly at £2.99 for a pack of 5 inc free delivery...
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/365053664182 (obviously you don’t use the nuts that come with them). However, as the bolts are bright zinc plated they’ll be more visible in the wheel arch.

 

[S1jor]

Did you replace those funny spider washers that hold the disk to the hub, am going to be doing mine soon, can’t work out if they are needed/recommended