Failed and seized injectors

B

BobHarrington

New member
We all read and heard the horror stories of failed injectors, which are then found to be seized into the cylinder head, and the subsequent cost in time and money. I’m told they fail due to a build up of carbon, and the risk of this happening can be greatly reduced by an annual treatment of TUNAP 979 furl additive.
Before I rush out and buy some, I thought I’d ask you knowledgeable guys out there what you think?
 
There are a number of injector cleaning additives on the market. I have used them with diesel engines and older early fuel injected engines, not heard of TUNAP 979, certainly shouldn’t do any harm. I think what’s most important is to always use a premium high performance petrol such as Shell V-Power (or equivalent) They contain cleaning additives within the blend and the lowest ethanol content. The seizing issue is another matter altogether.
 
BobHarrington said:
Hi MikeM, I always use the premium petrol ~ does the brand matter? Is any one, better for us than any other?
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Have a listen to Episode 3 of Chris Harris & Friends Podcast…

https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-car-podcast-with-chris-harris-friends/id1760521161?i=1000670131951

For me, the best motoring PC 👍
 
Just happened to have received October's Jaguar Enthusiast Magazine. There's a Q&A section with Tom Robinson of Swallows. They recommend using Tunap 979 for preventative maintenance to help clean carbon build up. After that you can use the cheaper product (974) that prevents recontamination. Yes, the 979 is expensive (£54 on Amazon) but compared with a set of new injectors it seems well worth it for peace of mind!
 
From what I've read previously, the only additive known to do anything of note is PEA. The Tunap 979 does contain that in 5-10% levels, but so does the 974. Redline SI-1 contains nearly 30% and costs <£20 a bottle - https://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-1028-red-line-si-1-fuel-system-cleaner.aspx

In terms of 'which fuel is best', all of the premium unleaded fuels contain better cleaning additives to some degree or another and they will all say they are better than their competitors. I try, where possible, to use Tesco's Momentum fuel, adding a small amount of additional cleaning additive with every fill (Archoil AR6900P Max, as it also contains PEA) and a bottle of SI-1 once a year.

EDIT: Worth noting, I am NOT an expert in these matters (far from it!) and haven't done a lot of research. I also have no ties or links to any product sold or places selling them.
 
BobHarrington said:
Hi MikeM, I always use the premium petrol ~ does the brand matter? Is any one, better for us than any other?
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If you can get Esso Synergy Supreme 99, it is considered one of the best fuels for engine performance and cleaning. It also, (unless it has recently changed) for some parts of the country has no Ethanol content. Which is great for older/classic cars.

https://youtu.be/3FPqeda5tcA
 
My approach...

to reduce the risk injector failure:

- Only use branded high octane petrol
- Use a bottle of injector cleaner with each annual oil change/service - my dealer includes that

to reduce the risk of injector seizure:

- If the car will be washed or subject to heavy rain, put on the engine cover which I've modified with additional rubber flaps to divert any water that comes in through the bonnet vents from the engine block. That's a rather obvious mod for any RWD F-Type with the original bonnet design. I have a black pack car which includes the tighter shrouded bonnet vents which don't let that much water in. If you have a non-black pack car with the open vents this mod is even more important.
- Keep it garaged and nice and dry as much as possible.
 
I use BG44 as it's recommended by Jaguar. The product page talks about a high amount of PEA without specifying the ratio.

https://bgprod.co.uk/index.php/products/pour-in-products/fuel-system/bg44k

I learned from a specialist that the "secret" is in how these additives are used. Don't throw a bottle in when you'll go on a long motorway journey when your fuel will be used up in a day or so.

You need to give it time to work. Ideally, the car should go through at least 13 driving cycles (drive for at least 10 miles and let it cool down for at least 4 hours each time) within 1 to 2 weeks to give the additives the best chance at breaking down the carbon deposits.

I make sure that I do at least one Italian tune up while the additive is in the tank.
 
The problem I have with BG44K (I did use some a few years ago) is that their Safety Data Sheet (SDS) makes no clear mention of PEA, despite their web-site claiming high levels of it being present. Given their claims, I'd like to see some evidence.
 
WShudds said:
I learned from a specialist that the "secret" is in how these additives are used. Don't throw a bottle in when you'll go on a long motorway journey when your fuel will be used up in a day or so.

You need to give it time to work. Ideally, the car should go through at least 13 driving cycles (drive for at least 10 miles and let it cool down for at least 4 hours each time) within 1 to 2 weeks to give the additives the best chance at breaking down the carbon deposits.

I make sure that I do at least one Italian tune up while the additive is in the tank.
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Good stuff, that's really useful advice.

I thought a couple of times about chucking in a bottle of BG44K between services but for some reason it seems rather hard to get hold of here on the continent. Liquimoly have some available alternatives but I don't know how good they are.
 
My 2019 P380 with 22k miles is in an Indy garage right now with a failed and seized injector. I only use Shell V-power so that wasn't enough to prevent this from happening.

Seems to be the luck of the draw - pretty disappointing that this has happened after only two years of ownership. Should get the car back at the end of the week once the injectors in the left bank have been replaced and there are no complications getting them out.
 
Mine went after only I month of owning the car the garage I brought it from sorted with my independent. Mines a 2019 p380 I only had 17k on mine when they went. Done under 3rd party warranty. I feel your pain it puts doubt in your mind once you get the car back. What next or will they foul again. I’m going to sort out a new warranty when mine runs out at the end of the month. Count yourself lucky I’ve also had the SOS limited functionality error this was an Ariel fault that the warranty sorted.
 
I still can't comprehend how an injector can fail at such low mileage. I've asked before if anyone has done any testing on a "failed" injector to confirm the fault or if they're just getting stuck open or close due to deposits and replaced without an attempt to clear the deposits using something like the BG 44K.

I also question if the issue is compounded by short distance driving and long storage times.
 
No Warranty over here, will see how it goes - if an injector fails on the right bank in a short amount of time then I'll not be best pleased.

The consensus seems to be carbon deposits that causes them to fail, I'll be looking for any explanation on what went wrong with mine if its possible and try and see if there is a way to reduce the risk of it happening again. I don't do loads of miles in mine, so maybe more regular use reduces the chance of them gumming up.
 
Got the car back today and its running sweet again. All injectors on the left bank were replaced including the one that was stuck on the head - all the spark plugs were also replaced - the work of course wasn't cheap.

There was evidence that water had got in to the left side of the engine including one of the spark plug wells that was full of water.

The does look like a significant design flaw with the bonnet vents and I'll be looking for some sort of solution that diverts water away from the engine to try and reduce the risk of this happening again.

I've seen a few posts already involving tape or rubber floor mats fixed onto the engine cover, however I'd prefer something that clips on and looks less home made.

I'll keep looking and post here if I find a good solution or please feel free to point me towards some good info if you've found something.
 
Thanks for the update and for keeping us posted. Glad the car is running fine again. If you could share the price here and whether it was done at a dealership or indy, that'd be helpful.
 
Glade your back up and running. It would be good to share the price of the works. I’ve used the rubber roofing material to cover mine like others have done I just used black mastic to stick the pieces on the engine cover. I done this due to my injectors going at 17k my work was done under 3rd party warranty I’ll 100% be getting a warranty renewal when mine runs out.

Would be interested to see if any new shape v8s have had any injectors go with the vents being lower down the bonnet. Is this just a water issue or just something we f type owners have to live with.
 
Anyone have any thoughts on whether using the fuel additives would affect the manufacturers warranty? I can’t see anything in the docs but there was another thread on here that mentioned that it may do (not sure how they would know either)

Just returned to F-Type ownership and loving being back but also now remembering the slight fear of owning one!
 
Shane_Red_V6S said:
Anyone have any thoughts on whether using the fuel additives would affect the manufacturers warranty? I can’t see anything in the docs but there was another thread on here that mentioned that it may do (not sure how they would know either)
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That's very unlikely. The main dealer where I have serviced my Jags for years pours a can of injector cleaner in the tank with every annual service.
 
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