Engine Oil / Fuel Pump / Oil Leaks...

T

TheAsh

New member
Hi Team, seeking advice (as I guess most on here are - sorry for stating the obvious!!)

My 2014, 3Ltr, V6 S F-Type last year (works completed November ‘23) went into some form of meltdown. She would idle for 5 mins, then start to fart and splutter (not drivable), and then cut out.

Took her to a garage (not JLR but a Jag / Land Rover expert). After a few weeks of 'looking into it', first the injectors, then the fuel pumps (petrol in the engine oil), then the fuel pumps didn’t have the buckets (not sure where they would have gone after 14,000 miles of ownership - or are they actually needed!?) on the fuel pumps etc. - this was a nice £3,000 job!!! The car still has the following 3 codes (which is did at the time - but guess these were unrelated to any issues and not so important!?) P0341- 00 & P0346-00 for Camshaft position sensor A - circuit range/performance Bank 1 & Bank 2; and p0430-00 Catalyst system efficiency below threshold (bank 2).

Anyway, now 2,000 miles and six months later; car dumped it’s oil (lovely looking drive now!!) - garage looked at car, and one of the fuel pumps brackets had failed (half hanging out the sump!) and the job done and replaced under warranty. Get the car back on Wednesday - and some 40 miles later - all the oil just been dumped (with fuel smell in)!!

I did notice that the oil went to 'Engine Oil Level Overfilled' and I'm assuming, by the smell of petrol in the oil - this is because the engine block was taking on board some petrol !?

Any obvious ideas from those in the know, as I'm losing the will to live with the garage not purely just saying 'oh Mr N, we know what that is and we'll get it all sorted for you'!!?

TIA - Ash
 
Whereabouts are you? Maybe someone in your locality can suggest a place they trust to sort it out?
 
Sorry to hear about the ongoing troubles with your F-Type. It sounds like quite the ordeal! From what you've described, it does seem likely that the excess oil and petrol smell could be related to the fuel pump bracket issue.

Given the history of work done and the recurring problems, it might be worth getting a second opinion from another garage or a Jaguar specialist. Sometimes, a fresh set of eyes can spot something that was overlooked before.

Also, since the engine oil level is overfilled, it's crucial to address this promptly to avoid any potential damage to the engine. If the garage is not providing clear answers or solutions, it might be time to escalate the issue within their service department or seek assistance from a different authorized Jaguar service center.
 
Hi @SCM - I'm in Haywards Heath, West Sussex.

@Sulliana - thank you. The overfill has just started, before it's dumped all it's oil again (assuming the 'new' fuel pump may have failed again!!) - I'm guessing that some form of failure is allowing fuel in via the sump, before it fails.

Looking at all the sides effects of the Camshaft position sensors; I'm not sure why this was not done as part of stage one!! If the engine is not running as should, due to the sensors, then if feels like all the other faults could be a direct output of the engine not running 100% - Injectors, Cat efficiency, fuel pumps....

Could a fuel pump be 'physically' push out of the sump!?

Does a F-Type Fuel Pump need the 'buckets' as mine (I was informed!) originally didn't!?

Wish there was someone fully in 'the know' to just talk to on these issues.....!!!

Cheers

A
 
Thank you Kev - this does give me both confusion and comfort at the same time. Confused why there 'weren't' any tappets (referenced as buckets in my initial draft) on the pumps, but comfort they're supposed to be there!! These things don't just fall-off do they!!!???

I guess I'm more concerned (or confused - again!!) that after 2,000 miles the Pump (Front one from the notes) can be 'forced' out or the bracket broken; and then 40 miles later, something similar happens (won't know until the garage collects later!).

Anyone with brain capacity / knowledge out there know if the HP Fuel Pumps can be 'pushed' out via the Auxiliary shaft (this seems very unlikely to me!! - but I wouldn't know!)???

TIA

The Ash
 
I think your car suffered from technician misdiagnosis (possibly) and gross misconduct (more likely). You can either try to escalate and resolve the issue with them or take it elsewhere.

One thing I learned over the years is that you only take medical advice that you learned yourself is the correct course of action. The same goes for cars. When I had an issue with my O2 sensor two months ago, I armed myself with knowledge and used it to test the technician that was going to work on the car at my local JLR specialist which had never dealt with (that's a key benefit of working with independent garages, you can't hide behind the front desk staff like it happens at main dealerships). I politely pretended that I didn't know much about what was going on and asked him to describe his approach to diagnosing the issue and correcting it depending on the possible outcomes. His answer was both eloquent and well informed. He told me about Topix and described what the manual says. Even when I pressed him about the issue being possibly linked to the ECU he could describe what he would do to rule stuff in and out. He probably realised I wasn't a layman half way through our dialogue but he kept it professional and probably got where I coming from.

I left knowing the car was in good hands but not before giving positive feedback to his manager. I also left them a positive review on Google.
 
Yep - well part of the problem is likely to do with the Camshaft sensors were not done (I thought - maybe stupidly!!) oh well, get these done sometime in the future as car is running fine; and hey, if the garage never changed them when trying to diagnose why the car keep idling funny, then cutting out, well, it's unlikely to have anything to do with these, hey!!

Anyway, the garage now has the car back, and the replaced 'front' high pressure fuel pump which 10 days ago 'popped' out as the bracket had failed, and was replaced. Anyway, 40 miles later and the exact same thing has happened.

So, did the fixing break, is there so much pressure in there, it's 'blown' out, or can these things be 'physically' pushed out from the internal mechanics of the car??

Help, I'm losing the will on this subject!!!!
 
TheAsh said:
Anyway, the garage now has the car back, and the replaced 'front' high pressure fuel pump which 10 days ago 'popped' out as the bracket had failed, and was replaced. Anyway, 40 miles later and the exact same thing has happened.

So, did the fixing break, is there so much pressure in there, it's 'blown' out, or can these things be 'physically' pushed out from the internal mechanics of the car??
Click to expand...

While definitely not an expert on this subject, this sounds to me like the pump and auxiliary shaft have not been reassembled correctly. Maybe missing one of the retaining bolts or the pump and shaft have been misaligned. As others have said, I'd be rapidly losing faith with your current repairer! Sorry I can't shed any light on your original issue.
 
Thank you for the view - I shall preserve as they ‘are’ meant to be good. Just the wider concern of ‘route cause’ and why certain (again, only based on my further research!) things weren’t (a) considered or (b) done; as part of the initial repair!!
 
TheAsh said:
Thank you for the view - I shall preserve as they ‘are’ meant to be good. Just the wider concern of ‘route cause’ and why certain (again, only based on my further research!) things weren’t (a) considered or (b) done; as part of the initial repair!!
Click to expand...

Based on the current code and symptoms, looks like the camshaft sensor was the original culprit. I wonder what led them to replace the injectors? Also, as much as I agree they should put it right, we could be talking about cowboys that made 3K replacing stuff unnecessarily and damaging others in the process apart from not resolving the problem.

It also seems that all that unburned fuel may have clogged your catalyst converter so if it can't be forced to regenerate, that will be £2K to replace.
 
Thank you WShudds; and I agree!! Firstly (assuming they’d need doing at some time) when I was informed 4 needed doing, then I was informed the ‘other two’ will need doing. Then, being informed that she (the car) was still not right, they informed me there was a smell of petrol in the oil; we’ll need to change the oil (again!) - and after a while, I was informed that it is the fuel pumps. I just said - ‘hey, just replace them both’. Anyway, all done and informed (after a month) the car is now fine and ready. £3,019 later all seemed fine. Well, apart from the ‘low efficiency’ on one of the Cats; when I asked the person in November ‘will that be ok’ - I was informed ‘yep, shall be ok and will clear; as it’s a petrol - if it was a diesel it might have been a different story’.

Anyway, we are now at this ‘current / new’ chapter just over 2,000 miles later; nobody ‘touched’ the Camshaft sensor at all (very highly likely, part of the initial route cause) and here we (well, me - but really appreciating the insights / views) are again.

It was only today (hey, if the garage never saw them as an issue, why should I!?) when I really did some research; that I truly realised how important they really are / the damage that could be caused. I’m talking to my legal council in the background on this subject; as all I wanted to do is pay to have the job ‘solved’ and it feels like it’s all been a bit of a guessing game; whilst some of the basic ‘possible’ route causes weren’t even considered / done.

Sorry, a long, and ‘very’ frustrating response. Just now truly concerned on the ‘why’s and how’s’ the pump would ‘just push out’ - firstly, after the initially replaced pumps were install 2,000 miles ago; then the replaced one some 40 miles (and one messed up drive!!!) later.

What a bloody nightmare……. :-(

The Ash
 
It's a bit of a distance but I'd get it recovered to Tom Lenthall. Best specialist in the country and it sounds like you need a good one at this stage.
 
TheAsh said:
Thank you WShudds; and I agree!! Firstly (assuming they’d need doing at some time) when I was informed 4 needed doing, then I was informed the ‘other two’ will need doing. Then, being informed that she (the car) was still not right, they informed me there was a smell of petrol in the oil; we’ll need to change the oil (again!) - and after a while, I was informed that it is the fuel pumps. I just said - ‘hey, just replace them both’. Anyway, all done and informed (after a month) the car is now fine and ready. £3,019 later all seemed fine. Well, apart from the ‘low efficiency’ on one of the Cats; when I asked the person in November ‘will that be ok’ - I was informed ‘yep, shall be ok and will clear; as it’s a petrol - if it was a diesel it might have been a different story’.

Anyway, we are now at this ‘current / new’ chapter just over 2,000 miles later; nobody ‘touched’ the Camshaft sensor at all (very highly likely, part of the initial route cause) and here we (well, me - but really appreciating the insights / views) are again.

It was only today (hey, if the garage never saw them as an issue, why should I!?) when I really did some research; that I truly realised how important they really are / the damage that could be caused. I’m talking to my legal council in the background on this subject; as all I wanted to do is pay to have the job ‘solved’ and it feels like it’s all been a bit of a guessing game; whilst some of the basic ‘possible’ route causes weren’t even considered / done.

Sorry, a long, and ‘very’ frustrating response. Just now truly concerned on the ‘why’s and how’s’ the pump would ‘just push out’ - firstly, after the initially replaced pumps were install 2,000 miles ago; then the replaced one some 40 miles (and one messed up drive!!!) later.

What a bloody nightmare……. :-(

The Ash
Click to expand...

Wondering if and how your got this sorted? I ran a preventative scan today since last time was 6 months ago and found P0341 and P0346 stored on the ECM but not confirmed. I'll be watching it closely. Car's running absolutely fine.
 
Wondering if and how your got this sorted? I ran a preventative scan today since last time was 6 months ago and found P0341 and P0346 stored on the ECM but not confirmed. I'll be watching it closely. Car's running absolutely fine.
[/quote]

What scanner are you using to run preventative scan or any scan looking into scanner myself 🤔
 
Billymcmred said:
Wondering if and how your got this sorted? I ran a preventative scan today since last time was 6 months ago and found P0341 and P0346 stored on the ECM but not confirmed. I'll be watching it closely. Car's running absolutely fine.
Click to expand...

What scanner are you using to run preventative scan or any scan looking into scanner myself 🤔
[/quote]

Basically this one (mine is the 500s)
https://amzn.eu/d/iPRCaDU

Not cheap but it's quite comprehensive, standalone, battery lasts forever, built-in WiFi and Bluetooth to search code info on the go and to save and share reports, access to live data and doesn't drain the battery once you're done with it.

Mr GB reviewed it in this video and it convinced me to buy one

https://youtu.be/tsjItCoYe5U?si=Ve-S0JYvNxv7L8VM
 
WShudds said:
Billymcmred said:
Wondering if and how your got this sorted? I ran a preventative scan today since last time was 6 months ago and found P0341 and P0346 stored on the ECM but not confirmed. I'll be watching it closely. Car's running absolutely fine.
Click to expand...

What scanner are you using to run preventative scan or any scan looking into scanner myself 🤔
Click to expand...

Basically this one (mine is the 500s)
https://amzn.eu/d/iPRCaDU

Not cheap but it's quite comprehensive, standalone, battery lasts forever, built-in WiFi and Bluetooth to search code info on the go and to save and share reports, access to live data and doesn't drain the battery once you're done with it.

Mr GB reviewed it in this video and it convinced me to buy one

https://youtu.be/tsjItCoYe5U?si=Ve-S0JYvNxv7L8VM
[/quote]

Thank you will keep eye out for this one have seen Topdon before hopefully someone will be offering discount code on one YouTube video or another
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top