Battery charging - advice sought

[Baggers]

Hi. I know quite a number of threads already exist on this topic but I couldn't find anything quite like this so hoping someone with greater technical knowledge than me can give me some good advice.

My car has had much less use this year as I am able to work from home and Covid has eliminated all but unavoidable work travel. The car had a new battery on January 24th this year, but over the summer and through the autumn I was getting low battery warning messages every time I got in and went for a drive. I've been taking it out for a 40-50 mile spin once a fortnight. Feeling slightly paranoid about the possibility of coming out one morning to a completely flat battery I have recently bought the Jag (i.e. CTEK) battery maintainer for my 2014 V6 S, and had Crewe Jag fit the boot mounted cigarette lighter style port for ease of use. First week of use and all was well, the maintainer cycling through to full charge in about 12 hours. Since then though I've had a week with more customer visits and have driven the car fully 200 miles and hooking it up to the maintainer even for 24 hours won't get the green fully charged/pulse light to come on.

Because of my battery paranoia I have a little plug in volt meter that plugs into the cigarette lighter socket in the front and it reads a healthy 14.7-14.8V when the engine is running and drops down fairly quickly to 12.6V after switching off, which would normally indicate the battery is in rude health? Yesterday though I checked about 4 hours after switching off and it was reading 12.3V and when I took it out just now it was reading just 12.0V, so it seems like I have something drawing badly on the battery, but the car is left locked with everything off each night.

So, possibilities as I see it could be a duff maintainer, the connection to the charger port could have come adrift (can't see anything obvious), something unknown drawing heavily on the battery, duff battery (though it's only 11 months old?), or perhaps even an alternator or BMS issue? Or am I worrying about nothing?

The car will need to go in (again, sadly - its had a few issues such as the dreaded injector failure this year which are testing my bank balance and generating significant grumbling from the missus!) shortly as the dash top vents have conked out, but thoughts in the meantime would be very welcome!

Have a good Christmas (I know, I know..) all

Thanks, Martyn

 

[scm]

Has anything been plugged into the OBD port recently? Some folks report that some devices leave modules in an active state instead of going to sleep. Check the hazard switch half an hour after locking the car and make sure (through the window, don't open the car!) its back light is off. If it's on, the "cure" is to disconnect the battery for a few minutes (just the neg or pos lead depending on what's easiest for you) and then reconnect and all should be well.

If that's not the problem, it sounds like you have a faulty module that's not shutting down (assuming you haven't inadvertently left an interior light on (I got caught like that by brushing against the overhead concole briefly which was enough to turn the light on). The battery disconnect trick might work for that, too, of course.

My cat tends to sit unused for days at a time and I've never had the "low battery" message, and my CTEK has never taken 24 hours to get to the green light (I realise I'm tempting fate here!).

Good luck sorting it out.

 

[Anonymous]

If it’s an early car then it has two batteries - were they both changed? Is it possible that the smaller aux battery could be the problem. Just a thought, I don’t know the details of the system but others on here may have better knowledge/experience

Hope you get it sorted

 

[Baggers]

If it’s an early car then it has two batteries - were they both changed? Is it possible that the smaller aux battery could be the problem. Just a thought, I don’t know the details of the system but others on here may have better knowledge/experience

Hope you get it sorted

Thanks, just the main battery in the boot rather than the front one, I understand the small one at the front is just for the stop start function and many members on here have disconnected it anyway without problems?

 

[Baggers]

Has anything been plugged into the OBD port recently? Some folks report that some devices leave modules in an active state instead of going to sleep. Check the hazard switch half an hour after locking the car and make sure (through the window, don't open the car!) its back light is off. If it's on, the "cure" is to disconnect the battery for a few minutes (just the neg or pos lead depending on what's easiest for you) and then reconnect and all should be well.

If that's not the problem, it sounds like you have a faulty module that's not shutting down (assuming you haven't inadvertently left an interior light on (I got caught like that by brushing against the overhead concole briefly which was enough to turn the light on). The battery disconnect trick might work for that, too, of course.

My cat tends to sit unused for days at a time and I've never had the "low battery" message, and my CTEK has never taken 24 hours to get to the green light (I realise I'm tempting fate here!).

Good luck sorting it out.

Thanks for the quick reply, I'll repost once I get to the bottom of it. Its a negative on the hazard light and there's definitely no interior lights on, so it looks like something isn't shutting down properly and drawing from the battery. I'll try the disconnect trick anyway once it's light and if it ever stops bloody raining, and if that doesn't work I'll get the dealer to investigate it when they fix the vent motor, which fortunately - given the season - is stuck in the 'up' position rather than in its bunker!

 

[scm]

Thanks, just the main battery in the boot rather than the front one, I understand the small one at the front is just for the stop start function and many members on here have disconnected it anyway without problems?

AIUI, the smaller battery is just used to power "essential functions" while the car is shut down - if the car detects insufficient resource to maintain those functions it disables stop/start. Not sure why you say "at the front" - surely both batteries are in the boot/trunk?

 

[Anonymous]

They’re not. Big one in boot, smaller one in engine bay.

 

[scm]

They’re not. Big one in boot, smaller one in engine bay.

Well I didn't know that, how on earth did they fit it in? :?

 

[Lunar]

Also never heard of it being in the engine bay before.

https://www.ftypeforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=412

EDIT: Looks like this https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/f-type-x152-72/auxiliary-battery-purchasing-options-211404/

And it must only have been quite early cars with the separate eco battery - mine is an AGM combined one.

 

[ninetails]

Baggers

I have had the OBD port "session" not ended correctly, and causing the red hazard light and the door lock light to stay on continuously. As scm said, in his reply, this can be cured by disconnection/ re-connection of the battery. I have also had another battery drain problem causing the "low battery start engine" warning to appear. When i checked, the door lock lights (after 30 seconds approx.) and the hazard light (after another 4 minutes approx.) turned off after locking the car doors (as it should). But when i looked through the side window later on the hazard light was back on and the door lock lights were flashing on and off for different lengths of time, as if going through a "checking" procedure. After a time both lights switched off, showing the electrical system had shut down again, but after a time the the door and hazard lights would come back on in the same way and the procedure would start again. My guess was, something was draining the battery and the "battery monitoring system" (BMS) detected it and kept "waking up" the electrical system, it then tried to find out what circuit was left on, to shut it down, but could not find any circuits left on, so recorded the voltage of the battery and shut down the system again. When the battery voltage dropped another 7% the procedure started over again. I assumed at the time as my car was 5 years old, with the original battery, it was due to the battery not being able to hold a full charge and therefore voltage was draining away. This went on for about 3 months and although i did not get caught out (car always started) i often got the "low battery start engine" message.
Then one day i was reversing into my narrow driveway and the "parking aid" warning beeps were annoying me, so i turned down (or so i thought) the volume by using the steering wheel buttons. When parked up i switched off engine and although the radio was tuned off i could faintly but clearly hear the radio station playing. I now think i pressed the wrong button on the steering wheel and turned the "beep" volume up by mistake, which let me just hear the radio when i switched off the engine.
I then went into "settings" on the centre screen (Home) then "system" then "adjust volume", and adjusted all 4 different volumes (sat nav, parking aid, traffic announcements, phone) with the radio turned OFF. When i switched off the engine i now could not hear the radio playing faintly in the background. Also the hazard light switches off after locking car and stays off, never had a "low battery start engine" message since (4 months later still OK).
I am convinced that there is a software problem that lets the different volume circuits get "tangled up" with the radio volume and confuses the electrical system. IF i ever adjust any of the 4 volumes i do it with the radio switched off.
This "cure" was done as described. but disconnecting/re-connecting the battery might achieve the same.

 

[Jaguandy]

I found this in the repair manual. I assume any chassis earth will do for the negative connection of a charger, just not direct onto the battery negative.

 

[scm]

I connect mine to the point where the negative battery cable is bolted to the chassis, under the boot cubby. Those instructions refer to connectng a slave power supply, which is apparently neccessary when updating software, not a charger.

 

[gasgas]

ninetails, the car will shut down any circuits not needed when the car goes to start and need all its volts to turn over the engine.

 

[Baggers]

Yes I think only the earliest cars had the small auxiliary battery under the bonnet - it's just in the offside front corner of the engine bay on mine, an early May 2014 V6S.

Thanks in the meantime - Some useful advice there gents and more for me to try. I've disconnected/reconnected the battery earlier today and checked the hazard light and door lights and all seems normal (i.e. Off!) but there's definitely something not right as there's been a drain overnight again and the battery maintainer just can't cycle through to a full charge. It's booked in at my local specialist for further investigation and to fix the conked out centre vents just after Christmas anyway, so I'll repost once it's (hopefully!) finally sorted. It's a real shame as it's run faultlessly for the 4 years I've had it until 2 months ago and then a whole bunch of things have all given up the ghost at the same time

 

[scm]

... it's run faultlessly for the 4 years I've had it until 2 months ago and then a whole bunch of things have all given up the ghost at the same time

With luck it'll be a single point of failure that's causing all the issues - it'd be a bit of a coincidence for multiple faults to have occurred simultaneously. Fingers crossed for you!

 

[Baggers]

... it's run faultlessly for the 4 years I've had it until 2 months ago and then a whole bunch of things have all given up the ghost at the same time

With luck it'll be a single point of failure that's causing all the issues - it'd be a bit of a coincidence for multiple faults to have occurred simultaneously. Fingers crossed for you!

Thank you, yes I can't help but feel they are linked, and there's no doubt in my mind that the issues I'm having are arising from it suddenly being used much less this year and sitting outside in the rain. Will let you know how I get on

 

[Baggers]

Well the car is finally back. I'll not lie the last 3 months with my F-type have been an absolute trial and the couldn't give a shit attitude of Crewe Jaguar hasn't helped in the slightest.

As it turned out the failed centre vent motor cooked the battery - that's what the dealer says at any rate - as it was not shutting down properly on leaving and locking the car, and I've now had to fork out not just for a the new vent unit but also for the battery as well. In the last 2 months I've now paid £1500 for 3 new injectors and a £600 bill for this (I. e. the vent and another new battery), particularly galling when I paid Jaguar Crewe £350 to fit a new battery on 24th January 2020 (at my request) The car has been serviced annually and I just think the list of component failures isn't good enough for a 6 year old car. Jaguar UK are apparently of the (unproven) view that the failure of the battery was due to the failure of the vent motor and are willing to contribute absolutely nothing. Sorry folks but this is why Jaguar is on its arse in the UK. Not only is this the most unreliable car I've ever owned but the incompetence and attitude of the dealers is simply unacceptable. I was proud to buy a British built car back in 2016 but the experience I've had over the last 6 months has put me off ever buying a JLR vehicle again. Sad to say but I will go with the 'obvious' German competitors next time. At least they won't leave me waiting for Green Flag to turn up on a more or less weekly basis..

 

[ralphr1780]

I feel sorry for your journey.
In my personal view and based on experience, you shouldn't expect other car manufacturers/dealers to be any better. The Germans produce more hence trouble cases are more diluted and appear as rather isolated, affecting less their image.
Just hope to be lucky enough not to pick one with such an issue.

 

[scm]

I've found my four Jaguars to be at least as reliable as any other car I've had, and more reliable than some German ones (VW Golf, anyone). The trick is to avoid dealers as they're used to working on new cars at either Jaguar's or the customer's (usually considerable) expense so money is apparently no object. I've found a trusted independent who values his reputation and actually cares about keeping his customers both happy and customers!